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The channel for discussion strictly on the topic of tulpas. Take off-topic discussion to #lounge Forum's Tulpa Discussion Board: https://community.tulpa.info/forum/4-general-discussion/
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Wonderlands not real
😑 1
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Indeed, it is imagination.
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Yup. He feels it's much more entertaining to just be in there
10:21 PM
The most active are Cerbeloth, Mortem, Ivona and Raphael - as I said the first three because they've got an online social life, and Raphael because I'm currently focusing on forcing him
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Abvieon {Alex} 5/13/2018 10:24 PM
Wonderlands can be ridiculously immersive. It's still daydreaming, but may go beyond the 'level' of daydreaming most people are able to do.
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parallel processing not real
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^
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Abvieon {Alex} 5/13/2018 10:25 PM
That doesn't have anything to do with what I just said meowthinkingglare
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it does though
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parallel processing is real, it's just really difficult
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since he was saying like his tulpas were functioning in the wonderland separately from him
10:25 PM
that's not a thing
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Abvieon {Alex} 5/13/2018 10:25 PM
I was just talking about being in the wonderland in general, not necessarily "tulpa being in wonderland while the host is doing other stuff"
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In the end, its still a human brain. And that cant do more then one thing at once.
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@Srn347 it's very limited
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Abvieon {Alex} 5/13/2018 10:27 PM
I really think that having more than one consciousness in the brain changes the way in which mental resources can be distributed. It doesn't 'add' anything or increase the processing power of the brain as a whole, it's more of splitting what's already there
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I think that if parallel processing exists then it's limited to whoever's active at the time
10:28 PM
whoever's actually thinking and doing things
10:28 PM
not "wooo my tulpa is in the wonderlaaaand"
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why wouldn't it apply to the rest of the system?
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because if you're not thinking then you're not thinking
10:29 PM
it's as simple as that
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Regardless of the interpretation the bottom line is, if Luke happens to get a chance to act (whenever and however that may be) he prefers doing stuff that's involving Wonderland more than anything related to the real world.
10:30 PM
It's still a low amount.
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Abvieon {Alex} 5/13/2018 10:30 PM
I mean, that would be saying it is the exact same thing as multitasking, which a single consciousness cannot do beyond something that vaguely resembles it, such as driving and singing a song at the same time
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some things are more or less automated, or you shift your focus rapidly between two things
10:30 PM
can't actively focus on two different things at once
10:31 PM
definitely no background focus of a tulpa doing stuff in wonderland
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Abvieon {Alex} 5/13/2018 10:32 PM
You are still describing multitasking. If there is more than one consciousness, they have separate perspectives and thus can experience different things simultaneously
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No...?
10:32 PM
there's only one main stream of thought
10:32 PM
we've been through this you know
10:33 PM
we used to think that we could function separately from our host and do shit in the wonderland
10:33 PM
we used to say things like "Well there's multiple minds so why wouldn't it be possible"
10:33 PM
but we came to realize it was all confabulation
10:33 PM
none of those memories actually had any substance, they were just fabricated when we tried to remember what we might have done
10:34 PM
really we just wanted to think we didn't just go inactive
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Well, then I'm not sure what he's doing. He might be just as inactive as others. (edited)
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Abvieon {Alex} 5/13/2018 10:35 PM
That does not prove that it cannot be done, even in your case. What you did may have been confabulation, but that is because you tried to do something you had not yet worked up the skill to be able to do yet and ended up convincing yourself you were able to do it. With parallel processing you have to start small, if you jump into something as difficult as that right away you'll crash and burn
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I really don't think it's possible no matter how hard you work on it
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Abvieon {Alex} 5/13/2018 10:36 PM
I would recommend talking to @Maya about it, she has reported experience in this area
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she said she's tried for years and is only able to stay active for a few seconds
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Abvieon {Alex} 5/13/2018 10:37 PM
She said "three minutes"
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Yeah, it's not seconds lol
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Anyways, thanks for the talk. As explained, I'll first seek therapy and continue working on switching in the meantime - in case therapy doesn't work, but even if the therapy turns out successful, it might be useful.
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Generally speaking, I do agree though: viability of long-term background simulation in wonderland is extremely low and any accounts of it are mostly just confabulation
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@Srn347 The brain "multitasking" is simply switching quickly between different tasks - certainly when it comes to focused thought.
10:42 PM
Getting better at "parallel processing" is therefore improving your skill at multitasking to reduce the inefficiency - but it won't be removed entirely.
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I still don't know about that
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The brain is also excellent at rationalizing and making up ideas of what happened if the person believes it should have happened.
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Abvieon {Alex} 5/13/2018 10:44 PM
Why does nobody consider the mechanics of how more than one consciousness may influence brain resource distribution? Everyone speaks as if having more than one consciousness changes nothing
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At minimum, 'simultaneous' activity introduces inefficiency, reducing the capability of performing each task. If you are normally performing at 100% when focused on one task, doing two simultaneous tasks would split that up.
10:45 PM
Alright, Abvieon. There is actually quite a simple test that can be done here.
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I feel like the rules aren't that simple, at least- rapidly bouncing back and forth doesn't really relate well to my experience in day to day as my host and I are generally both focused/aware for the whole time the other is, and conversations between us follow that same sense of awareness
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We can use math to test it.
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There's other mental overheads to consider, regarding tests.
10:46 PM
Try and do math aloud while some other physical person does math aloud next to you :p
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If you have two fully functional consciousnesses without any reduction in efficiency, you should be able to simultaneously do two math problems that you each find 'difficult but possible' to do mentally, in close to (if not identical to) the same amount of time it would take to do each of them individually.
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having more than one consciousness doesn't give your brain new capabilities, it just adds more people to use what you already have
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...though, that would indicate that you are also working at 50% efficiency at best, which is the point.
10:47 PM
The brain isn't so neuroplastic that creating multiple consciousnesses multiplies ability.
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Abvieon {Alex} 5/13/2018 10:49 PM
I mean, I see something as simple as a host and tulpa having a continuous conversation as requiring parallel processing to a small degree. I'd go as far as to say that I cannot see how co-consciousness is even possible without some. If parallel processing did not exist whatsoever, only one systemmate would be able to remain conscious at a time, with the others going unconscious. There may be a difference in how I and others define parallel processing, I don't know
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There's also similar issues with things like how your body can limit your sensory input- your eyes can only focus on so much and ears can listen to so much etc I'm also not suggesting parallel processing doubles your mental overhead, either. But on tasks that require different types of mental processing that don't have other bottlenecks, the tulpa and host will probably be able to do then in parallel :p
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@Abvieon {Alex} having a conversation requires the tulpa to be out and active, not off in some imaginary world, lol
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Conversation is simple.
10:50 PM
Processing is done on each side fairly linearly (with some minor exceptions).
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Abvieon {Alex} 5/13/2018 10:50 PM
I never did claim that being plural increased or added to your brain's abilities. It allows for a different type of division of what already exists. (edited)
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However, the test that I was proposing isn't requiring anything particularly special, nor is it requiring any sensory input to be constantly processed.
10:50 PM
Find four math problems you find difficult but possible to do in your head.
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The problem is that how would the participants actively listen/interrupt/formulate thoughts if the other was speaking
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Or even just three.
10:51 PM
Do one of them, focusing solely on it - time how long it takes to solve.
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Abvieon {Alex} 5/13/2018 10:51 PM
No, my point was that I cannot see how a tulpa can be "out and active" at the same time as the host if parallel processing did not exist.
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Then, you and your tulpa simultaneously do the other two and time how long it takes to do them.
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Winter, math still requires a lot of sensory input via reading and the issue where even two separate people will have a harder time if someone else is shouting out their own mental process in solving a different math problem
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If you are parallel processing to any serious degree, you should (a) finish roughly around the same time and (b) finish faster than it would have taken to do each problem in a row.
10:52 PM
...ah, Maya. You misunderstand.
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Brain=computer Tulpa/host=Login accounts You can login to one and do a task, then log back into the other. It might be fast...but, You can't login to both at the same time. -w
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You read each problem - which takes a fraction of the time, relatively speaking.
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Computer analogy is bad and wrong :p
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The sensory input is negligible in this case.
10:53 PM
Beyond that, the host doesn't constantly 'know' what the tulpa is doing in the wonderland at all times, correct?
10:53 PM
If that's the case, the tulpa can simply go into the wonderland and do the problem.
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I don't think that's the case at all. The time required to process the reading aspect of math can often be just as long as it would take to solve a simple problem. Additionally, not knowing what a tulpa does in wonderland is often a function of what me/apollo kinda subscribe to- tulpas just going idle when they've convinced themselves they're doing something else
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That should solve the issue of them "shouting".
10:55 PM
...that's why I didn't suggest a simple problem, Maya.
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Okay but then you're contesting simple and able to be solved in the head
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Not so.
10:56 PM
There are problems that can be solved in the head that take time to do.
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Often the two are correlated- if you have poor focus it could be hard to hold onto the moving parts :p
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Simple multiplication table problems won't work, but when you get into things such as... let's say 23*104 - this is possible to do in your head, but not possible to instantly know the answer on reading.
10:57 PM
Alternatively then, you could simply read two bits of information, and try to simultaneously store it in active memory.
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I totally could not solve 23*104 in my head nor store it in active memory :p
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not true, I instantly thought 2392 when I read that
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This could be information that is difficult to memorize, such as a sequence of letters and numbers that is at the limit of the person's recorded active memory.
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but then again I am a math major
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...it would also be possible to adjust for the individual.
10:57 PM
This is why I also pointed out: A problem that the person finds "difficult but possible" to do mentally.
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@Srn347 Nerd 😛
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